http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/2.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net
I'd just love to see how that holds up in court.

From http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/3869.page
[quote]SecuROM as been discussed and discussed so much and it causes arguments in threads. If you want to talk about DRM SecuROM then please use another fansite forum. If there is any change you will be able to read it on the official Spore site.

Please do not continue to post theses thread or you account may be at risk of banning which in some cases would mean [b]you would need to buy a new copy to play Spore.[/b][/quote]

Right, Spore is officially the last EA game I buy.

You just insist on digging a deeper and deeper hole for yourselves, eh? First, you harrass and punish your [i]legal[/i] users (without in any way inconveniencing those who pirated the game). Then you throw a tantrum when people bring up this problem on the forum (I guess we'll have to complain about it on Amazon then? ). And finally, you threaten to make our purchase invalid if we don't pretend to love everything about the game. I am so close to returning my copy of Spore. It was fun to play for a few days, but it's just not worth the hassle.

How a company can be so out of touch with its customers is beyond me. It'll surprise me if EA is still around in 5 years. I just hope they don't take too many others down with them.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41916.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41916.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41917.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41917.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41919.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41919.page GMT
I knew and experienced the rather harsh and self mutilating consumer policy of EA but this is beyond all reason.

Well erm, not sure anymore if I want to expand my spore universe. perhaps i will thru alternative means, just to spite them.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41924.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41924.page GMT
http://secusphere.com/smf/index.php

Hope this helps those who are finding it hard to discuss their frustration.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41925.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41925.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41926.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41926.page GMT
The idea that activity on a forum could result in essentially a real-world [i]fine [/i]is what I find shocking. Losing access to the forums, whatever. Banning a game account for repeatedly uploading offensive male members with malicious intent, fine. But forum questions == losing game account?? Not being able to play without paying $60 again?

Egregious. It implies a no-tolerance culture for dissent or criticism. It means I can't trust "positive" comments if I know "negative" comments are not only screened, their originators are banned as well. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41949.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41949.page GMT http://kotaku.com/5052473/ea-respond-to-drm-complaints

We're still stuck with SecuRom, but they are relaxing the ridiculous restrictions on install limits.

But really, go outside, take a few deep breaths of fresh air and relax. Hysteria, threats and ranting aren't going to help you. What EA seems to respond best to are relatively calm and well reasoned arguments, not emotional melodrama.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41951.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41951.page GMT
The idea that activity on a forum could result in essentially a real-world [i]fine [/i]is what I find shocking.[/quote]

Why? There's the same issue with MMOs. Your forum account is attached to your game account. Don't want to lose your game account? Don't act like an idiot on the forums.

And we're not talking about just asking questions on the forum. We're talking about continuing to repost topics that have become spam now, and about 90% of the new posts on the DRM have been childish trolling anyway. The threads break down into flamewars, so the best way to deal with it is to ban the threads.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41958.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41958.page GMT
Or could it be because thousands of players have made it clear very loudly and very explicitly that they think this is unacceptable?

Yeah... hard to tell...
No, EA responds best to things that make them look bad, and make them lose customers. And saying "oh, it's not so bad, go outside and get some fresh air" is not going to do that.
EA reacts best to hysterical melodrama, not to reasoned arguments. Because the melodrama scares away customers, while reasoned arguments don't.

No, they're hardly "backing down". They're increasing the limit from 3 to 5, but it's the limit itself that's unacceptable.
And that has nothing to do with this post.

I think it's completely unacceptable if our activity on this *forum* can get us locked out from the *game*. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41964.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41964.page GMT
Its like when you go to the store, find a cool game. Then you notice is says.

"Warning, This is owned by EA. We will hassle you and make your gaming experince a living hell intell we controll every inch possible in every video game store possible."]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41974.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41974.page GMT
So they're allowed to withdraw the product I paid for because of that? I can understand why they'd want to ban people from posting on the forum, if they make EA look bad. But banning from the game? The game that we paid $50 for? Do we get our money back, then? Or does that just mean we've paid $50 for nothing?]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41990.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41990.page GMT
So they're allowed to withdraw the product I paid for because of that? [/quote]

Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them.

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41995.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/41995.page GMT
Note, that doesnt mean I believe it is morally right for them to do it, but that I dont care that much about them doing it. I do have other big beefs with EA and honestly... I bought spore and I'm like "It's EA but it was really made by Maxis, So I am alright" then a few weeks later I get Warhammer Online thinking oh a new Mythic MMO and suddenly I see EA branded on it... *sigh* oh my birthday comes along and my friend gets me Rock Band 2... hell yeah Harmonixes new game and EAs new money maker...

EA has alot of problems.. but their purshasing of megadevelopers means that they no longer hace to rely on the terrible titles they used to put out... instead they can just claim they mae other titles. Hell a friend of mine was like "I hate Rockband, its made by EA" and im like "No it isnt it is only published by EA"... hes not a game dev person, so he doesnt see the difference... much like most people wouldn't...

Its nice to see history repeating itself... anyone else remember the game crash... lots of terrible games, alot of them with advertisement for non game things all over them... customers getting fed up... overproduction of game systems that noone is buying...]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42001.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42001.page GMT
Or could it be because thousands of players have made it clear very loudly and very explicitly that they think this is unacceptable?

Yeah... hard to tell...
No, EA responds best to things that make them look bad, and make them lose customers. And saying "oh, it's not so bad, go outside and get some fresh air" is not going to do that.
EA reacts best to hysterical melodrama, not to reasoned arguments. Because the melodrama scares away customers, while reasoned arguments don't.

No, they're hardly "backing down". They're increasing the limit from 3 to 5, but it's the limit itself that's unacceptable.
And that has nothing to do with this post.

I think it's completely unacceptable if our activity on this *forum* can get us locked out from the *game*. [/quote]

I sent no prayer, although I did make a relatively reasonable complaint to their customer service. My main point was that you are spending way too much time, energy and rage on a [i]video game[/i]. You're going to give yourself a stroke if you don't learn to relax. Put down the cheetos, step away from the keyboard and go get some frsh air and sunshine. Don't post angry, and they won't have a reason to suspend/ban your account.

They are increasing the [i]number of machines it can be installed on simultaneously[/i] from 3 to 5, and are adding a option to deauthorize computers- which essentially removes the install limits. Very few complained that they could only install it on 3 computers at once- what people were concerned about was that reinstalls, such as after a OS refresh or hardware upgrade, would be counted toward the 3-install limit.

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42015.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42015.page GMT I sent no prayer, although I did make a relatively reasonable complaint to their customer service.[/quote]
And achieved how much, exactly?

[quote]
My main point was that you are spending way too much time, energy and rage on a [i]video game[/i].[/quote]
Me? You're the one spending your time responding to threads for no reason. I'm posting because I think their policy is a problem. you're posting because..... you're.... bored? Or maybe because you *like* the restrictions?
In either case, I don't think I'm the one who needs to be worried about how much time I'm spending on this.

[quote]Don't post angry, and they won't have a reason to suspend/ban your account.[/quote]
You sound like it'd worry me if I got banned. I've already played the game for a couple of days. I don't need to play it more right now.

They are increasing the [i]number of machines it can be installed on simultaneously[/i] from 3 to 5, and are adding a option to deauthorize computers- which essentially removes the install limits. Very few complained that they could only install it on 3 computers at once- what people were concerned about was that reinstalls, such as after a OS refresh or hardware upgrade, would be counted toward the 3-install limit.[/quote]
Yes, and now try engaging your brain. How often do you uninstall all your software before formatting/upgrading your computer? For that matter, how often do you uninstall before your harddrive breaks? If I no longer have the original computer, am I able to "deauthorize" it?

[quote]Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them. [/quote]
I don't recall agreeing to any contract when I paid for the game. But care to enlighten me? Where does it say?]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42077.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42077.page GMT
If you're really worried, there are ways around it. Outsmarting EA isn't exactly difficult.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42099.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42099.page GMT
Now if you posted SPORE on here, then banning you from the game would be acceptable, but not if you are just complaining about an outrageous anti-pirating tactic they are using.

Edit: (The word whose definition is a media where adults "display their love" is replaced by the word spore)]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42118.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42118.page GMT
[/quote]You sound like it'd worry me if I got banned. I've already played the game for a couple of days. I don't need to play it more right now. [/quote]

If it doesn't worry you, why post about it? And even if they ban your account, you can still play the game offline. You just won't be able to share your creations with the world.

[quote]Me? You're the one spending your time responding to threads for no reason. I'm posting because I think their policy is a problem. you're posting because..... you're.... bored? Or maybe because you *like* the restrictions? In either case, I don't think I'm the one who needs to be worried about how much time I'm spending on this. [/quote]

Yup, I'm bored and wandering around the forums. I'm responding to you because you're a goofball and I think you are misguided and misinformed. Of course, I shouldn't respond to your post unless I agree 100% with you, right?

[quote]Yes, and now try engaging your brain. How often do you uninstall all your software before formatting/upgrading your computer? For that matter, how often do you uninstall before your harddrive breaks? If I no longer have the original computer, am I able to "deauthorize" it? "[/quote]

They haven't released exactly how they will implement the deauthorization procedure. It might suck or it might work. You are jumping to conclusions. EA has referred several times to the way iTunes limits music files. On iTunes, you CAN deauthorize a computer AFTER it crashes, or even if you no longer own the computer. You deauthorize it via the online account, not the physical hardware of the computer on which you had it authorized. Since they are working with the online verification of the authorization code, it should be entirely possible to deauthorize a particular computer, even if you wipe the hard drive or even send the whole machine to the grave.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42216.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42216.page GMT I understand players frustration, and will again post a link to a forum dedicated to secuRom. Where you can vent/discuss/debate the issues freely. I am not for or against DRM, [i]but am trying to help players to not get banned.[/i]
And maybe a moderator could explain if the ban is from the forum, or the spore site and online sharing. As I think they are seperate...I could be wrong
http://secusphere.com/smf/ ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42237.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42237.page GMT And maybe a moderator could explain if the ban is from the forum, or the spore site and online sharing. As I think they are seperate...I could be wrong
http://secusphere.com/smf/ [/quote]
Um, they said that already. That's why I posted this thread. The thread I linked to said pretty explicitly that discussing DRM on this forum can lead to your being banned from the game, and having to buy a new copy of Spore. So I think perhaps you should have read the thread I linked to before accusing anyone of trolling.

[quote]Cry more and make them do it your way! Scream, shake your little fists, and hold your breath until you turn blue. Then EA will listen to you for sure! By all means, don't act like an adult. [/quote]
What you call "acting like an adult" (in other words, sucking it up, and keep paying EA more money) is what gave us Spore's DRM in the first place.

And you know what? So far the only thing that has managed to make EA back down on DRM is, in your words, "screaming and shaking your little fists". So yes, if it's ok with you, I think I'll continue to do what EA has already shown they notice.

People "shaking their little fists" got Mass Effect's DRM loosened a bit. People "shaking their little fists" has so far given us two additional installs on Spore. We *know* that this strategy makes EA listen.
Which smashing victories can your strategy of "sucking it up and not really doing anything much to show we don't like the DRM" report?

[quote]If it doesn't worry you, why post about it? And even if they ban your account, you can still play the game offline. You just won't be able to share your creations with the world. [/quote]
Because I think it's a ridiculous business practice, and I hope they'll change it in the future. And because others may be interested in knowing about this.

[quote]Yup, I'm bored and wandering around the forums. I'm responding to you because you're a goofball and I think you are misguided and misinformed. Of course, I shouldn't respond to your post unless I agree 100% with you, right? [/quote]
I didn't say you shouldn't respond. I'm just saying that if you do respond, and the only thing you have to say is that I should go get some fresh air, don't accuse *me* of making pointless posts or wasting my time. At least I had a relevant point to make.

[quote]They haven't released exactly how they will implement the deauthorization procedure. It might suck or it might work. You are jumping to conclusions[/quote]
So are you. I'm just saying that they haven't yet solved this problem. Therefore it is still a problem. Yes, they may at some point in the future solve it, but then [i]you[/i] are the one jumping to conclusions. I'm talking about how it works *now*, and what they have promised to do. That is, what we *know*.
You are talking about what you hope they'll do.

But once again, this has nothing to do with the thread. This thread was about their apparent policy of banning you from the *game* for discussing DRM on the *forum*. Not about DRM. Thanks for trying to change the subject into something that *will* get the thread closed.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42294.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42294.page GMT I DID read that and it says IN SOME CASES it could require another purchase of the game, so there you go. I was hoping for a little clarification, not arguing the DRM issue, in ANY way.
And I was not accusing ANY ONE in particular for trolling/flaming...and I used both terms, trying to be non partisan on the DRM/no DRM argument.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42302.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42302.page GMT
As moderators, we're here to help and keep things on track, we're not here to censor discussions unless things get rude and offense. We moderate by the forum guidelines that are publicly posted. I've been gone for a week but I'm trying to catch up on what's been going on.

Just know that we are here to help and even if we don't have an answer, we do listen.


]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42315.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42315.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42326.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42326.page GMT
Well, there was a time when Electronic Arts, to me, meant, "This game is gonna ROCK!" Seriously. Some of my fondest memories of gaming--and I've been gaming since my age was in the single digits, back in the scary old 1980s--came from EA games.

But ever since their logo stopped being this:
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/eb/Electronic_Arts_historical_logo.svg/300px-Electronic_Arts_historical_logo.svg.png[/img]

...I've stopped enjoying their products.
I'm not saying the logo controlled anything, but...it marks time, and the time I dug EA games like a backhoe was when their logo was that.

I mean, c'mon...Archon, The Bard's Tale, Populous, Mail-Order Monsters, Wasteland, etc...these were games that put EA on the map for me. But since those days...ehhh...I see the EA logo, and I worry that what I'm about to play may well be crap.

...and that's to say nothing at all with EA policies, just game quality.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42362.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42362.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42367.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42367.page GMT
As said, discuss things in a mature and responsible manner and I think you will see things not disappear.

While seeing someone "threatened" about being banned does not seem to be all that customer service friendly if it was a maxis or EA employee then that someone needs a boot in the butt. If it was a volunteer sporemaster then they need to re-read their forum monitor rules.

I also think it's a given that everyone on these forums understands the general opinion of SecurROm and other similar programs. So try and keep things civil peeps.


Deeeeeeeeep Breath.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42381.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42381.page GMT
So they're allowed to withdraw the product I paid for because of that? [/quote]

Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them.

[/quote]

I'm just wondering where in the SPORE's EULA can you read that (if it is the contract you are talking about)...]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42397.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42397.page GMT
O and I still find it quite funny that if people don't like what you say they give you one star....like that invalidates the post......NOT.

You all are too funy... ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42406.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42406.page GMT
O and I still find it quite funny that if people don't like what you say they give you one star....like that invalidates the post......NOT.

You all are too funy... [/quote]you make a good point]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42426.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42426.page GMT
Sad sad day. It's one thing to want to censor the boards (which I do not agree with provided the topic is in fact the game) BUT to threaten you with loosing the copy of spore that you have paid for? GTFO! That is really an eye opener. Thank you for posting it. That is ... wow ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42531.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42531.page GMT
EA will burn for this.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42547.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42547.page GMT
After activating your copy of the game with a valid CD-Key (or with an invalid one, but that's not a topic for this forum at all), you CANNOT BE BANNED from using the Spore software. Your Spore account could be banned, which would prevent you from logging into the server in the game. This would stop online content delivery and use of the in-game and onsite Sporepedia, and forfeit the right to upload any creations. However, you could still play the game. The EA representative in question likely knew this and meant "you will need to buy another copy [to be able to access the community again]."

If anyone has any questions or doubts on this matter, please feel free to PM me.

EDIT: By the way, [b]this is not a defense of EA. I hate DRM and want it to die. And burn and die more.[/b] Just wanted to clear some things up, as there were claims of "my $50 game etc etc!"
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42548.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42548.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42549.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42549.page GMT
O and I still find it quite funny that if people don't like what you say they give you one star....like that invalidates the post......NOT.

You all are too funy... [/quote]

Yes they can deny you service but then you don't get charged for your food or they don't pump your stomach for what you've already eaten and paid for.
You think this is acceptable now but what happens when it becomes you loosing your game because you state an unfavorable comment? If they are going to enforce this sort of censorship then you won't even be able to trust the "all for it" comments becuase you'll always wonder what people REALLY thought.

If this is their policy then I am done with them. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42565.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42565.page GMT
O and I still find it quite funny that if people don't like what you say they give you one star....like that invalidates the post......NOT.

You all are too funy... [/quote]

I think it's not quite a good analogy.

First: you don't pay for the meal and get a copy of a contract stating a behaviour policy before sitting at the table.
Second: access restrictions ("refuse admission rights reserved" or whatever is called in USA) got to be very well backed up with right, legal arguments because arbitrary bans could be well censored by a court. Yes, even in a "private business" there are civil rights no one can surpass.
Third: And, you know, there are clauses/terms/conditions that are intrinsically abusive for the consumer.

Banning a legitimated user that payed 50$ for the use of game features (like spore servers) because he wrote in the forum about something that is not stated or directly against any clause in the EULA is arbitrary and should be penalized by law

Disclaimer: I'm not a legal eagle and my english could be pretty clumsy ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42575.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42575.page GMT
O and I still find it quite funny that if people don't like what you say they give you one star....like that invalidates the post......NOT.

You all are too funy... [/quote]

Yes they can deny you service but then you don't get charged for your food or they don't pump your stomach for what you've already eaten and paid for.
You think this is acceptable now but what happens when it becomes you loosing your game because you state an unfavorable comment? If they are going to enforce this sort of censorship then you won't even be able to trust the "all for it" comments becuase you'll always wonder what people REALLY thought.

If this is their policy then I am done with them. [/quote]

Sigh...never once did I say I agreed, I was just trying to give a situation that was similar. I believe I also said I did not think that being threatened was a very nice thing to do (if you had read one of my earlier comments you would see that) Try not to jump to conclusions, especially about something written on a game forum, please.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42582.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42582.page GMT
Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. As I said before, you are allowed to discuss things as long as it's done in a civil manner.

Believe it or not, EA does listen to your concerns and they are working to make things run smoother. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42594.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42594.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/3869.page )

I feel obligated to speak up a bit and try to get people to self moderate a bit.

Now, my whole reason for that post was because at that time there were posts... and I mean good posts full of very intelligent discussion, critique and complaints that were being thrown out left and right without any reason given, any notice, or any guidelines or statements being made that the subject was taboo. Many of them just disappeared, and every single one of the others was locked - any further posts were threatened (as seen) leading to confusion over whether the topic was outright barred or what. The digital restriction management was just the most widely discussed and visible of those topics.

Granted some of them were probably thrown out because of users who could not control themselves, however the job of moderating is to deal with those people and let the rest of us interested in mature and in depth conversation continue on. When you summarily and silently black bag threads, well... we all know the comparisons or conclusions that can be made.

I was not nor am I out to crusade against EA or Maxis. Do I have problems with some of their business decisions and policies, sure. However, I merely wanted to be treated like more than an inconvenience or a fly on the wall to be squashed just because I made some noise.

Criticism =/= trolling, and some people need to realize and accept this. You might not like hearing a bunch of negative feedback ... and obviously there is a TON of it... but it IS important for the companies to hear and acknowledge it when so much of the consumer population has an issue.

So please do conduct yourself in a mature and civil fashion, and put away the molotov cocktails and pitchforks - we don't need senseless and undirected rage but discussion and sensible feedback (even if it is negative).

Thanks.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42595.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42595.page GMT
Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. As I said before, you are allowed to discuss things as long as it's done in a civil manner.

Believe it or not, EA does listen to your concerns and they are working to make things run smoother. [/quote]

[b]This was done in a Civil manner, yet he was threaten on loosing his GAME and to be forced to buy another copy.[/b]

[quote]I and many others here have got some serious questions about the forums, the lack of professionalism, and the need for information that is not being communicated to the users.

Are we not allowed to discuss SecuROM or DRM at all in the forums anymore?

What is the situation with the silent locking and deletion of topics going on? Shouldn't there be a standard?

Is there somewhere in particular this topic should be discussed?

Can we get moderating team leads that communicate with their users? [/quote]]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42626.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42626.page GMT

Edit to add: EA really does listen to the feedback, negative and positive and they really do want to make things right. We are not sure who made those comments in that thread and it's being investigated. You will not lose your game.

-Topics that are locked should now contain an explanation for the lock.

-You are allowed to discuss the DRM and any concerns as long as it's done without making it personal to anyone.

-As far as moderator communication, that's what I'm trying to do.

Feel free to pm me with concerns and I'll try to help. Just keep the pms civil, I won't respond to anything rude but I will help those who really want it. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42631.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42631.page GMT
Thanks.
[/quote]

QFT.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42635.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42635.page GMT
From http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/3869.page
[quote]SecuROM as been discussed and discussed so much and it causes arguments in threads. If you want to talk about DRM SecuROM then please use another fansite forum. If there is any change you will be able to read it on the official Spore site.

Please do not continue to post theses thread or you account may be at risk of banning which in some cases would mean [b]you would need to buy a new copy to play Spore.[/b][/quote]

Right, Spore is officially the last EA game I buy.[/quote]
Yes, that particular quote absolutely crosses the line. When you complain about a Ford SUV, Ford doesn't disable that SUV so you can't drive it anymore. When you complain about taxes, the government doesn't lock you up for complaining. If you complain about a ride at an amusement park, they work with you to find a solution instead of kicking you out and ignoring you (imagine the media circus if that happened). EA policy of potentially banning people from their products for their opinions crosses into new territory. While it is true that a forum like this is [i]not a public institution and therefore not subject to freedoms of speech[/i] enabling people to spout off at will, there are [i]consumer protection and discrimination laws[/i] specifically to prevent the scenario of someone losing access to what they bought because of [i]diverse [/i]opinions and lack of disclosure. Someone needs to think this through. Complaints of discrimination could be company-destroying once they hit the national limelight. We all know how much the media hates games.

[b]What's worse is that the ban apparently affects your EA Account. Therefore, it may be possible that the ability to play other games may be revoked as well.[/b] Obviously it wouldn't apply to GameSpy accounts, but it would apply to other games using the EA Account. [b]I would like to see someone from EA comment on this concern[/b] because it could potentially mean one foul up results in hundreds of dollars of losses. It reads to me like blackmail. This has to be just some sort of typo or misunderstanding because I can't fathom EA taking things to this extreme. If you banned a brother over a matter of opinion, we'd all be up in arms so this has to be some sort of miscommunication or mistake and I hope EA sets the record straight..]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42647.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42647.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42665.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42665.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42675.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42675.page GMT
[quote=sporemasterladym]You are not going to lose your game for posting a comment.

Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. As I said before, you are allowed to discuss things as long as it's done in a civil manner.

Believe it or not, EA does listen to your concerns and they are working to make things run smoother. [/quote]

Also Lady M,

Sorry for making your day difficult.

I am glad to see that the issues are being addressed, truly. I only wanted clarity on the situation and to express our concerns about the quality of the forums.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42677.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42677.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42681.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42681.page GMT
I actually was at EA this weekend reviewing some new games coming out. I've always found everyone I've met there to be nice and helpful so I'm sure they will get this sorted out and we can get the forum back on track.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42694.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42694.page GMT
I'd just love to see how that holds up in court.

From http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/3869.page
[quote]SecuROM as been discussed and discussed so much and it causes arguments in threads. If you want to talk about DRM SecuROM then please use another fansite forum. If there is any change you will be able to read it on the official Spore site.

Please do not continue to post theses thread or you account may be at risk of banning which in some cases would mean [b]you would need to buy a new copy to play Spore.[/b][/quote]

Right, Spore is officially the last EA game I buy.

You just insist on digging a deeper and deeper hole for yourselves, eh? First, you harrass and punish your [i]legal[/i] users (without in any way inconveniencing those who pirated the game). Then you throw a tantrum when people bring up this problem on the forum (I guess we'll have to complain about it on Amazon then? ). And finally, you threaten to make our purchase invalid if we don't pretend to love everything about the game. I am so close to returning my copy of Spore. It was fun to play for a few days, but it's just not worth the hassle.

How a company can be so out of touch with its customers is beyond me. It'll surprise me if EA is still around in 5 years. I just hope they don't take too many others down with them.[/quote]Freedom of speech is being banned?

EA or whoever..how dare you. I hope you read these forums and see how much you have pissed off your customers. You are one of the worst run companies I have seen ever! You are and have put into place rules and guidelines that only push us away, and make our gaming experience with you an awful one. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42697.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42697.page GMT
[quote=sporemasterladym]You are not going to lose your game for posting a comment.

Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. As I said before, you are allowed to discuss things as long as it's done in a civil manner.

Believe it or not, EA does listen to your concerns and they are working to make things run smoother. [/quote]

Also Lady M,

Sorry for making your day difficult.

I am glad to see that the issues are being addressed, truly. I only wanted clarity on the situation and to express our concerns about the quality of the forums.[/quote]Missed this...

EA: Ok, then if you want to do it right, post updates and lower the cost of a new expansion!]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42707.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42707.page GMT
Again as everyone else on here has said, stop jumping to conclusions.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42727.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42727.page GMT
Trust EA to reach this new low in corporate heavy handedness.

I too remember when EA meant good games, but those days are long since past. EA has long since stopped being a game company and become a corporation who's only purpose is to buy up developers and milk their franchises until they've managed to bleed every ounce of fun out of them.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42763.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42763.page GMT
Trust EA to reach this new low in corporate heavy handedness.

I too remember when EA meant good games, but those days are long since past. EA has long since stopped being a game company and become a corporation who's only purpose is to buy up developers and milk their franchises until they've managed to bleed every ounce of fun out of them.[/quote]

Did you skip over the the posts where we've been re-assured that won't happen? ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42777.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42777.page GMT
The idea that activity on a forum could result in essentially a real-world [i]fine [/i]is what I find shocking.[/quote]

Why? There's the same issue with MMOs. Your forum account is attached to your game account. Don't want to lose your game account? Don't act like an idiot on the forums.

And we're not talking about just asking questions on the forum. We're talking about continuing to repost topics that have become spam now, and about 90% of the new posts on the DRM have been childish trolling anyway. The threads break down into flamewars, so the best way to deal with it is to ban the threads.[/quote]

I actually have never had an MMO keep my game account banned.

I've been quite a trouble maker and gotten banned on a few MMO's wow included (only on forums) and they with a simple request unbanned my account in game (and for wow even on forums).

Just a matter of company integrity. The forum+game ban for them is just because their forum and game share sql dbs.

[quote=sporemasterladym]It's okay, I've been out of the loop for over a week due to Spore and traveling so I've been catching up on what's been going on.

I actually was at EA this weekend reviewing some new games coming out. I've always found everyone I've met there to be nice and helpful so I'm sure they will get this sorted out and we can get the forum back on track.[/quote]

You tell them!]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42798.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42798.page GMT
Did you skip over the the posts where we've been re-assured that won't happen? [/quote]

I don't generally find it reassuring if the left hand doesn't know what they right hand is saying :p]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42828.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42828.page GMT
Did you skip over the the posts where we've been re-assured that won't happen? [/quote]

I don't generally find it reassuring if the left hand doesn't know what they right hand is saying :p[/quote]

True but people can make mistakes and it looks like they have cleared the problem up. But if people keep perpetuating the misconception, it only degrades further into paranoia. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42839.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42839.page GMT
Did you skip over the the posts where we've been re-assured that won't happen? [/quote]

I don't generally find it reassuring if the left hand doesn't know what they right hand is saying :p[/quote]

True but people can make mistakes and it looks like they have cleared the problem up. But if people keep perpetuating the misconception, it only degrades further into paranoia. [/quote]

YES! I'm trying to stop the mass panic.. don't press that button!!!

I've spent the last few hours here trying to reassure everyone that it's okay. I can understand if you doubt me but that's okay too. Soon you'll be eating cookies out of my hand.

Now I want to play Spore, I hope it's safe to leave for awhile. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42856.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42856.page GMT Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. [/quote]

Of course there is...it's [i]FUN![/i]

Haven't had a good burning-at-the-stake in [i]ages![/i]

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42909.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42909.page GMT Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. [/quote]

Of course there is...it's [i]FUN![/i]

Haven't had a good burning-at-the-stake in [i]ages![/i]

[/quote]yeah i havent burned anyone alive in a while too <_< >_>]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42914.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42914.page GMT Ok, thanks.

I think you got this idea from my message, but I'm just retyping this to be clear for everyone else who might not have gotten the purpose of the message. I can understand stopping complaints or discussion about a particular subject. This is a privately owned and operated board where Maxis/EA defines what is and is not discussed as well as whom can and cannot participate. However, revoking one's ability to play their game based on opinions or actions outside of the game crosses into new territory that I think everyone agrees is off limits. This has [i]nothing [/i]to do with Securom or DRM, it's all about account setup and management.

[quote=mussashi]Freedom of speech is being banned?

EA or whoever..how dare you. I hope you read these forums and see how much you have pissed off your customers. You are one of the worst run companies I have seen ever! You are and have put into place rules and guidelines that only push us away, and make our gaming experience with you an awful one. [/quote]
[b]This is not a public institution.[/b] You have no freedom of speech inalienable right here. Your freedom of speech goes only as far as the operator determines it should go. You can talk about whatever Maxis/EA allows you to talk about because they own, operate, and manage the boards here. Topics off limits are to be avoided.

[b]The issue that is in dispute here is not DRM, freedom of speech, or game quality. It has to do with account management policies in which your actions here on a forum could revoke your ability to play a game.[/b] It's a big brother thing, so to speak. As Lady M pointed out, it seems that there's some miscommunication or account management issues that need to be ironed out.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42923.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/42923.page GMT [quote]Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them. [/quote]
I don't recall agreeing to any contract when I paid for the game. But care to enlighten me? Where does it say?[/quote]

This is another point which people have seemed to construe to their likings. It also says ON THE BOX, in small print, right next to where it says "Only one registration available per game", "...and END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT REQUIRED TO PLAY." That means when you were installing the game and you clicked the "I AGREE" button, you agreed to whatever it said in all that print that came before the installation.

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43091.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43091.page GMT the small letters translated: 'access to online content only after online registration'. apparently that's also the place to find the terms and conditions. (i should check the reaction of a shop clerk once when i ask for an internet connection to see those before i buy anything lol)
more surprisingly it's been ranked 12+ and what's really funny: 'only playable after electronic registration' in quite big letters on the front and small letters on the back: 'you have to be 16 years or older to register'

ps edited for some translator corrections]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43342.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43342.page GMT
It's not stigmata, it's holes in the hands and feet from shooting themselves so many times.... oh, wait you said stigma.... nevermind... lol

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43361.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43361.page GMT [quote]Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them. [/quote]
I don't recall agreeing to any contract when I paid for the game. But care to enlighten me? Where does it say?[/quote]

This is another point which people have seemed to construe to their likings. It also says ON THE BOX, in small print, right next to where it says "Only one registration available per game", "...and END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT REQUIRED TO PLAY." That means when you were installing the game and you clicked the "I AGREE" button, you agreed to whatever it said in all that print that came before the installation.

[/quote]
[/quote]

And where in the EULA does it say that they can invalidate your copy of the game for posting about DRM on the game's forum? You haven't answered the question.

And of course, this doesn't take into account that EULA's are generally unenforcable and invalid in many countries (typically because you have to buy the product before you can see the terms you've bought it under, or just because the terms are so ridiculously one-sided that they don't actually hold up in a courtroom)

So please, try again. Where is this contract I agreed to *when I bought the game*, which specifies that the product I bought may be rendered useless if I don't behave on this forum?]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43658.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43658.page GMT I've spent the last few hours here trying to reassure everyone that it's okay. I can understand if you doubt me but that's okay too. Soon you'll be eating cookies out of my hand. [/quote]
Well, that's nice to hear, and I'd love to believe you. But how does it fit together with this thread?

http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/list/3869.page

As long as that thread exists, and carries the message it does, I think a bit of skepticism about your claim is justified.
Of course, we can't see who added that red text so it might have been the poster himself, but I think it's pretty logical to assume that it was added by whoever locked the thread. Which means someone official. Which means the threat it makes should be taken seriously.

[quote]Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. [/quote]
Oh, I don't know. So far, assuming the worst has turned out to be mostly justified. Unless you'd care to argue that the whole DRM debacle doesn't qualify as "the worst"...
At least, there are a few thousand Amazon reviews that seem to think "the worst" is exactly what we got. But of course, that's a different discussion. Just making the point that as long as that is ongoing, plenty of people *will* assume the worst, because that's what they feel they've been getting until now.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43721.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43721.page GMT
Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. As I said before, you are allowed to discuss things as long as it's done in a civil manner.

Believe it or not, EA does listen to your concerns and they are working to make things run smoother. [/quote]

Alright. Where is the fun of demonizing you folks when you keep being so SPORE nice.

You are making the job of the hecklers and ranters so much more difficult.

I would of prefered.

[quote=sporemasterladym]NOT ONLY ARE YOU GOING TO LOSE IT ALL BUT WE SHALL EAT YOUR CHILDREN! [/quote]

Or something epic like that.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43731.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/43731.page GMT Of course, we can't see who added that red text so it might have been the poster himself, but I think it's pretty logical to assume that it was added by whoever locked the thread. Which means someone official. Which means the threat it makes should be taken seriously.[/quote]

I'm that poster, and I can assure you I was not the source... the minute it was added after being locked I lodged a complaint in the forums feedback thread, PM'd a moderator I know to be reliable both requesting that it be looked into.

I certainly did not appreciate the threat, but just looking at all the grammar and spelling errors indicates to me that it was not the work of someone who should be moderating, especially anonymously. In my complaint I also suggested the possibility of security issues given the software they are running it wouldn't be a first time... so it is possible it's not the work of EA at all but a script kid having a temper tantrum to try and sabotage.

LadyM said they are looking into to, and I believe that to be true - I have seen an improvement and the rampant kidnapping of threads and anonymous editing of threads seems to have ceased. What you said about it continuing to send a bad message is true however, and they have my blessing if they would like to delete it.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44248.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44248.page GMT http://kotaku.com/5052473/ea-respond-to-drm-complaints

We're still stuck with SecuRom, but they are relaxing the ridiculous restrictions on install limits.

But really, go outside, take a few deep breaths of fresh air and relax. Hysteria, threats and ranting aren't going to help you. What EA seems to respond best to are relatively calm and well reasoned arguments, not emotional melodrama.[/quote]

I personally think the only reason they retracted it is one of their legal team pointed out that if they pulled that SPORE they would have an unwinnable class action lawsuit on their hands.

This is a PR blunder of truly EPIC proportions. People wont forget about it in a hurry and the gaming news sites CERTAINLY wont. Is it any wonder that the gaming community is so damning of EA when they pull stunts like this?]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44284.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44284.page GMT http://kotaku.com/5052473/ea-respond-to-drm-complaints

We're still stuck with SecuRom, but they are relaxing the ridiculous restrictions on install limits.

But really, go outside, take a few deep breaths of fresh air and relax. Hysteria, threats and ranting aren't going to help you. What EA seems to respond best to are relatively calm and well reasoned arguments, not emotional melodrama.[/quote]

no i dont feel we should back down infact i attached a link to this thread to the BBB and all the major news stations abc nbc cbs and fox! EA needs to learn a lesson they think they are above the laws and think that they can take away a paying customers rights to play the game and then go as far to state BUY IT AGAIN! thats against the law they cant do that, why because we call them names and poke fun at their non working DRM! screw you EA i will expose you if its the last thing i do!]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44418.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44418.page GMT
So they're allowed to withdraw the product I paid for because of that? [/quote]

Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them.

[/quote]

I'm just wondering where in the SPORE's EULA can you read that (if it is the contract you are talking about)...[/quote]

That would be this part:

[quote]EA may revoke or terminate this license at any time, for any reason or no reason, in its sole discretion[/quote]]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44465.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44465.page GMT
So they're allowed to withdraw the product I paid for because of that? [/quote]

Yes. And it's perfectly legal. You might try reading contracts when you agree to them.

[/quote]

I'm just wondering where in the SPORE's EULA can you read that (if it is the contract you are talking about)...[/quote]

That would be this part:

[quote]EA may revoke or terminate this license at any time, for any reason or no reason, in its sole discretion[/quote][/quote]

I'm not so sure about that being "perfectly legal" I'd like to think that any reasonable court would examine the terms of the "contract" and decide that EA should be the ones paying us to accept the rubbish in their EULA.

I believe also that EA throws their claim to enforcability out the window where they basically refuse to have any responsibility to uphold their end of the deal. Oh, and where they offer the "contracts" sight-unseen to people with no legal capacity to agree to legally binding contracts.

I paid for Spore (Galactic Ed), but all the crap going on with the DRM and EA's irritating tone of condescencion and stubborn refusal to understand the perspective of their customers has got me thinkin' about a refund.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44601.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44601.page GMT
Ever.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44660.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44660.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44705.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44705.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44708.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44708.page GMT
Indeed, I've not got my hopes up or anything. Just looking into what conditions that might entitle me to a refund under the law of my country, not under EA's wishlist of fairyland conditions in the EULA.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44752.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44752.page GMT
Actually, my forum account is different than my game account. I can see my game account, but when I registered for the forum, I must have mistyped the name ( oops ) Never the less, my forum account is different than my Spore account ( At least I think it is lol )]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44773.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44773.page GMT
Again as everyone else on here has said, stop jumping to conclusions.[/quote]

Well, to be honest, we are talking EA here. The first Sims game had what, 6 paid expansions? At least that, might have been 8. The second one has... heck if I know, I must have seen at least 10. Possibly more. The last couple SimCity products have had at least one each (well, last couple I have, which is 4 and Societies), possibly more as well.

So basically, EA has a long (and profitable) history of doing many paid expansions. And to make matters worse, they have a continuing outgoing cost with this game (the Spore servers), which their other games lacked. So, I'd have to say, thinking that we are going to get much (if any) free content is somewhat naive. And in the long run, as much as I hate to think it, counterproductive to us being able to keep the whole online aspect up and running.

Which means yeah, it's possible that they could issue us endless new content. It's also possible that we all might win the lottery tomorrow, right before a world-killer asteroid hits the planet. But the far more likely outcome is non-free expansions.

...all of which is totally off topic, really. At least there are not so many concerns now about the "talking about DRM will get you banned" issue now.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44783.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44783.page GMT I believe the Sims had the game then 7 expansions

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sims[/url]
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44789.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44789.page GMT
Good luck with that..

most places don't let you return a game, just exchange it for the same one. Your double beat with pc games since they won't even do that.

Face it, your stuck with it. Now go take your ritalin.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44793.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44793.page GMT I believe the Sims had the game then 7 expansions

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sims[/url]
[/quote]

Well, on average, I was right! ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44799.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44799.page GMT
As if that wasn't enough, many jurisdictions have legislation which imposes obligations on consumer contracts regardless of their terms. These include prohibitions on deceptive and misleading conduct, unconscionable dealing

In other words, don't assume that just because it's in a fancy document and uses long words that it actually has any legal effect.

Oh by the way, yes I am a trained and practising lawyer.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44802.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44802.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44823.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44823.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44830.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44830.page GMT
Game EULAs tend to ask a helluva lot in return for something that's entertainment. The buyer isn't expecting to gain any additional income-producing ability as part of the purchase. I don't think you could argue that people have the same expectation of being legally bound by entertainment products.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44849.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/44849.page GMT
Not that Spore's matters to me at this point. EA's shoddy treatment of it's legitimate customers has soured me on [i]ever[/i] buying from them again.

[quote]But we’re hoping that everyone understands that DRM policy is essential to the economic structure we use to fund our games and as well as to the rights of people who create them. Without the ability to protect our work from piracy, developers across the entire game industry will eventually stop investing time and money in PC titles.[/quote]
They still don't seem to have noticed that it was a complete and utter failure. Good job, EA, for the wonderful irony that your anti-piracy nonsense has made Spore the most pirated game ever.

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45125.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45125.page GMT
Just a friendly reminder. Avoid personal attacks, insults, cussing and other things that generally are against Forum Guidelines. Spirited debate is fine as long as it is civil.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45145.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45145.page GMT
and now for my opinion. I'm an animator on a tv series in Canada. One thing i've noticed in the tv and film industry to fight against piracy, has been to put the conent up online themselves. Like Comedy Central for example. Veoh is a great palce for broadcasters to post their shows. the reason it's okay, is because they include ads in the clips so they can still earn money. Completely legitimate.
That being said, i know it cant really work that way for video games, but there has to be a better way.
I personally feel that DRM has been proven to not work, and Spore is the cherry on top that proves that.
The DRM was hacked within the same day the game got leaked early. It seems like it was easier to hack then most games. So keeping the hackers away didnt work. The only people dealing with the SecuROM stuff has been the people that purchased the game. And if torrent files are any indication, 100K or more people downloaded it in the first week. Of those, 80% probably only did it to play the game early. However, once they found out more about the DRM issue, that percentage started to shift in favour of not buying the game.
Putting DRM on the game made it feel too much like going to dinner at a restaurant. You order your meal, but you arent gonna be allowed seconds or thirds. Fair enough in the food industry, but how is it fair in the gaming industry? I understand there are studies saying that people dont install on more then a couple machines at most in the games lifetime, but the it's the fact that you wont be allowed to if you so choose, is what is bugging people. I have games from the 90's, that i'll pop in and play from time to time. means i've installed the game on at least 5-10 machines already, and i'm sure i'll install it again on another few machines in the future. If it had DRM, if i were to call the dev to fix that, I wouldnt be able to. Partially because the dev is no more, but also becuase they wouldnt have support for the game in their system anymore. I think the big question that gamers really want to ask is how long will you be supporting this game? because once you stop, there wont be the option of re-installing it anymore.
Anyways, I've rambled on enough. Despite the DRM, i still bought Spore, supporting the Maxis devs for all their hard work. I do hope that things will be learnt from how people reacted to the DRM this time round, esp since it's clear that more and more people are getting on the anti-DRM band wagon.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45217.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45217.page GMT
Again as everyone else on here has said, stop jumping to conclusions.[/quote]

Well, to be honest, we are talking EA here. The first Sims game had what, 6 paid expansions? At least that, might have been 8. The second one has... heck if I know, I must have seen at least 10. Possibly more. The last couple SimCity products have had at least one each (well, last couple I have, which is 4 and Societies), possibly more as well.

So basically, EA has a long (and profitable) history of doing many paid expansions. And to make matters worse, they have a continuing outgoing cost with this game (the Spore servers), which their other games lacked. So, I'd have to say, thinking that we are going to get much (if any) free content is somewhat naive. And in the long run, as much as I hate to think it, counterproductive to us being able to keep the whole online aspect up and running.

Which means yeah, it's possible that they could issue us endless new content. It's also possible that we all might win the lottery tomorrow, right before a world-killer asteroid hits the planet. But the far more likely outcome is non-free expansions.

...all of which is totally off topic, really. At least there are not so many concerns now about the "talking about DRM will get you banned" issue now.[/quote]

I very much agree with you, BUT what is really annoying is that people post here on these forums in such a way that it makes it look like they know beyond a reasonable doubt that is the way it's going to be. And we just do not know. I'm all for expressing [u]opinions[/u] but say it's your opinion and don't act like you know what is going to happen UNLESS you have proof. Because one person getting all bent out of shape about something that is not clear, just results in a bunch of others getting all paranoid over something that, well....no one really knows the right answer.

I mean even after we were told by someone with authority that certain things weren't going to happen, people kept going on and on and on and on.

Please just stop inducing panic by posting information that has no validity. ]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45239.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45239.page GMT
I believe also that EA throws their claim to enforcability out the window where they basically refuse to have any responsibility to uphold their end of the deal. Oh, and where they offer the "contracts" sight-unseen to people with no legal capacity to agree to legally binding contracts.[/quote]

Actually, it's pretty standard IP law that the owner of said IP can revoke the license to use it at any time. And about the "sight unseen" part, When *I* installed Spore the EULA popped up at the very beginning of the install process...]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45247.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/45247.page GMT
I'm certain EAs lawyers have lengthy explanations of how it doesn't matter and everything's all fine and above-board though.
]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/46873.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/46873.page GMT
They technically can't since you can't read them until after you bought the game. Legally, you should be able to read them before paying money. Otherwise you're paying a fee without seeing the terms of the contract.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/47655.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/47655.page GMT
Actually, it's pretty standard IP law that the owner of said IP can revoke the license to use it at any time. And about the "sight unseen" part, When *I* installed Spore the EULA popped up at the very beginning of the install process...[/quote]

A license to use IP can only be revoked if there is a term of the licensing agreement that allows for that revocation. In business, this is almost never the case, as few companies would be willing to invest in IP they could simply lose. Similarly, an author licenses a publishing company to use their IP, the book, but this is virtually never revocable. Probably the clearest example, if an executive from Universal Studios turned up on your doorstep and said he was here to "revoke the license" to the DVDs you bought last month... well, I don't think he'd be leaving with any DVDs now would he?

When you installed Spore the EULA popped up. [u]After you had already paid for the game[/u]. So in terms of straight contract law, the EULA cannot have formed part of the contract as the transaction was already complete as soon as you paid your money and left the game store. As I mentioned earlier, some jurisdictions have interpreted software terms of service into the contract, but it is a stretch, and its not a stretch every jurisdiction has been willing to make.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/48525.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/48525.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124329.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124329.page GMT -Censored...
[color=white][size=8]'Cause you touch yourself at night[/size][/color]
-[/Censor]
I'm sorry i had to.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124333.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124333.page GMT
They technically can't since you can't read them until after you bought the game. Legally, you should be able to read them before paying money. Otherwise you're paying a fee without seeing the terms of the contract.[/quote]

In my opinion, according to the contract, once you open the game, its yours, yet you are agreeing to said contract blindly in my humble opinion. Catch 22? perhaps..

]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124336.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124336.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124365.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124365.page GMT
If Congess can't do it, nobody can.

Yay! More evidence of the EA dictatorship! As a citizen of the United States of America, I am entitled to the right of freedom of speech, religion, media, and so on. Other than than words generally accepted to be vulgarities, I think that EA is playing God-Mode with the censorship on this forum. Islamic people can't even say the name of their God. Why? I don't know. Probably because EA thinks we'll think of terrorists.

If I get banned for this, I don't know what kind of message this will send to the Spore community.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124414.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/124414.page GMT [quote=sporemasterladym]
I've spent the last few hours here trying to reassure everyone that it's okay. I can understand if you doubt me but that's okay too. Soon you'll be eating cookies out of my hand. [/quote]
[url=http://forums.ea.com/mboards/message.jspa?messageID=4344364#4344364]Ahem...[/url]

For those who are too lazy to click the link:
[quote]Your forum account will be directly tied to your Master EA Account, so if we ban you on the forums, you would be banned from the game as well since the login process is the same. And you'd actually be banned from your other EA games as well since its all tied to your account. So if you have SPORE and Red Alert 3 and you get yourself banned on our forums or in-game, well, your SPORE account would be banned to[/quote]

[quote]Again, there is no point in grabbing the torches and assuming the worst. [/quote]
Remind me again, why shouldn't people assume the worst.]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129238.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129238.page GMT http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129266.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129266.page GMT
This is the second time we see the claim that they are in fact linked. Odd that it pops up again, from a different EA representative, don't you think?]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129276.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129276.page GMT
This is the second time we see the claim that they are in fact linked. Odd that it pops up again, from a different EA representative, don't you think?[/quote]

Agreed :/]]> http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129281.page http://forum.spore.com/jforum/posts/preList/4676/129281.page GMT