My opinion is that Maxis will respond when they feel they have something solid and important to tell us. It would be hard for me to refute what you are going on about because they have not responded. That is true. But, I see their non response as them working hard to fix problems, where as you see it as they don’t care what you think or don’t want to hear your opinions. As you have said in another thread:

RocketGirl wrote:
What reason do we have to think that they ARE?

For all we know, they've decided that they will never, ever, EVER release anything--expansion pack, patch, whole new game, NOTHING--that will make Spore into the game Will Wright originally envisioned.
Until they explicitly SAY SOMETHING, we have no reason to assume anything at all.

But taking the position YOU are espousing, which essentially amounts to, "They're working on it, I just KNOW it!" is as illogical as any other possible position until we have hard information from EA/Maxis.
But you...you're just making SPOOR up, with your lists of what Maxis is doing, why they haven't told us anything yet, yadda, yadda, yadda. You don't know any more than I do--less, probably--but you're waxing eloquent like Will Wright whispered Maxis's business plan in your ear during a post-coital cigarette!

Maybe, like me, you should be agitating for Maxis to actually give us a solid word rather than all this playing "Pretend" and then spouting it as if it were sage wisdom, like you're doing. Y'think?

We don’t know either way. So does that make both our opinions wrong? The fact I think they are working hard to fix issues and you don’t think so? Again you can fall back on the fact they haven’t responded so that supports my position. I can fire back and say they aren’t responding because they are working on fixing things.

RocketGirl wrote:
I'm sick of hearing the same thing over and over!

Now I must laugh, you are sick of hearing the same thing over and over? What about the rest of us. Do you want me to go through all your posts and see how many times you have said the same thing over and over? I say they are working hard to fix issues and I think I can safely bet they are reading the forums and taking down all that is being said and what you have said especially with how many times you’ve said it.

I will respectfully ask that you stop disparaging me with your “past your bedtime” comments and “playing well with the other kids” comments. You have done just as much with the thinly veiled personal attacks as you feel I have.

Domo arigato Mr. Roboto?

Replies replies replies... if everyone in this thread worked at Maxis they'd have lawsuits up the SPOR-E-ORE. We reply here more than the executives take bonuses.

Jackuul wrote:Domo arigato Mr. Roboto?

Replies replies replies... if everyone in this thread worked at Maxis they'd have lawsuits up the SPOR-E-ORE. We reply here more than the executives take bonuses.

HAHHAHA, nice Jack....

Cysgodi wrote:What about all this don't you get? This is NOT 2005. Again we get that you feel that EA/Maxis/Wright misled you. God only knows WE GET IT. But guess what, it's done. It's past. Give it a rest already.

You all keep pointing out the same things over and over and over again. You just keep coming up with different ways of saying it.

Couldn't agree more. The game has went through three years of development since 05', and videos were posted as recently as 07'. How much will something remain the same over the course of three years? Something I don't get about the 05' zealots is what makes them so sure that back then the game was this ludicrously open ended sandbox with limitless possibilities of a game? You had a video and someone's word. I'm sorry if you bought into that. The fact of the matter is you didn't play the game back then, you don't know for certain what it's possibilities were, so proclaiming a horrific switch occurred is unfounded in my opinion. You're making it seem like you were duped on the streets by someone showing you a bunch of cards and switching them. THREE years went by. Videos were posted in 07'. If you can't accept the fact things are subject to change, then I'm sorry. We know the marine phase is absent which bridged the gap between cell and landfall, but what is that? An extra phase. If we did have it you people would be complaining about how pointless it is.

SporeMasterNumerator wrote:Of course you can stay and voice your opinion, but if your only intent is to incite and argue, then don't post.

• No personal attacks: don't flame, troll, insult, harass, threaten, rant
• Work out differences politely

RocketGirl wrote:You're an idiot;

Oh you mean like that?

111uminate wrote:

SporeMasterNumerator wrote:Of course you can stay and voice your opinion, but if your only intent is to incite and argue, then don't post.

• No personal attacks: don't flame, troll, insult, harass, threaten, rant
• Work out differences politely

RocketGirl wrote:You're an idiot;

Oh you mean like that?

I didn't look but is that the only thing she said in that post? If it isn't stop being a politician, skewing what people say for your own ends is a really prickish thing to do.

On a sidenote, people really need to stop speaking for others. Be it the guy saying "We are sick of hearing this" or the other guy saying "We get it!". There is no we, there is you. I don't mind when people say something is bothering them but it drives me nuts when they speak for a group of people that live entirely in their head.

Also if people aren't supposed to voice their disapproval then what are we supposed to voice? If you left the forum to positivity you would find yourself likely only seeing activity in the creature creator section. I say this only because for the most part that is the only place where it is present (short of my general discussion buddy list <3).

Not everything changes, in fact many things stay the same in the sense that they are in a continual decline from their original state. The national debt is a good example, so is the human form, and even stars. If people aren't allowed to address these issues then they will continue to stay as they are. There is nothing stopping us, but complacency.

We always find it alright to assume that nothing can be done to fix a wrong, but we likewise conclude that it is perfectly logical that great wrongs are perfectly normal. Be it a nuclear bomb or a lie, these things should never be taken with stride because the moment they do we all lose.

PS. Could someone post these videos? I keep hearing about the mythical videos that proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the NEW SPORE was obvious and forthright in its existence...but nobody provides links. I know I personally assume that the longer something takes the higher quality it becomes. But I've been told time and time again on these forums that one should assume the worst when something takes a while to make. Sort of like the quote above. (The one about THREE years). I've kept up with plenty games that took a year or more to make and none of them had the complete turnaround that this one did. I got what I expected and was informed of what was removed. I don't recall WAR (Recent MMO) hiding the fact that they had to remove towns and some classes/races to get things out on time. They were very open about it, MAXIS was not.

it's the one thing I wish Maxis would do a better job of. OK, there are many, but they have a news section, why not post stuff in there like "we sat around this week and picked our noses", or "we tried to fix the planet size bug, but Jim broke the graphics engine instead, so we're back to square one with that.". Doesn't have to be major ground breaking stuff, just a little note now and then to let fans know there is actually a team over there... or a person, that is doing something. Assign an intern or something, or someone that knows a little of that's going on to keep sort of a developers log. Might not be something we want to hear, like they are working on the expansion pack, instead of the bug list, but even telling us that goes a long way with the relationship between the devs and the community. I think it's called public relations... which it seems, is terribly lacking over there. It might even give people on this forum something to discuss instead of frustrating everyone with rumors and conjecture.

theultimateend wrote:
I didn't look but is that the only thing she said in that post? If it isn't stop being a politician, skewing what people say for your own ends is a really prickish thing to do.

Glad someone agrees with me.

111uminate wrote:And as for taking points and twisting them into pretzels, you've done a real bang up job of snipping my posts and replying to them within their snipped context. You're censoring and editing what I say to you and replying to that, not what I'm actually saying. Rofl.

I said that four pages ago.

111uminate wrote:

theultimateend wrote:
I didn't look but is that the only thing she said in that post? If it isn't stop being a politician, skewing what people say for your own ends is a really prickish thing to do.

Glad someone agrees with me.

111uminate wrote:And as for taking points and twisting them into pretzels, you've done a real bang up job of snipping my posts and replying to them within their snipped context. You're censoring and editing what I say to you and replying to that, not what I'm actually saying. Rofl.

I said that four pages ago.

I'm not a fan of people skewing comments. I try my best not to (not to say I'm not guilty, its usually a mistake).

On a completely off topic note and the reason I'm actually responding.

I love Pretzels...almost as much as crispy Bacon. If they were healthy I think they'd be two of my daily foodstuffs.

theultimateend wrote:
... Also if people aren't supposed to voice their disapproval then what are we supposed to voice? If you left the forum to positivity you would find yourself likely only seeing activity in the creature creator section...

Nothing wrong with disapproval, as long as it's supported in some way with something constructive. Criticism can be positive, complaining (not saying you are!!) only breeds negativity. I think Thumper said it best "if you can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all." That doesn't mean to keep your disapproval or opinions to yourself, it just means people need to contribute in a way that is not offensive. An internet forum has a different dynamic than say a conversation with a group of people, so it needs to be approached differently. A bunch of opinionated posts will result in opinionated responses, which result in more opinions... and while opinions are ok to voice, they aren't helpful because they are basically selfish terminated statements. Opinions are like... Sporeifaces, everyone's got one, and everyone knows it. So state your opinion if you must, but follow it up with why you feel that way. Give someone something to respond to and to discuss, instead of bating them into an opinionated statement of their own. And yes, maybe I'm not the best one to preach from the pulpit, but if we all make an effort to better conversation rather than force an opinion, I think (opinion alert!) the forum will be a much friendlier place.

StevenMC wrote:

theultimateend wrote:
... Also if people aren't supposed to voice their disapproval then what are we supposed to voice? If you left the forum to positivity you would find yourself likely only seeing activity in the creature creator section...

Nothing wrong with disapproval, as long as it's supported in some way with something constructive. Criticism can be positive, complaining (not saying you are!!) only breeds negativity. I think Thumper said it best "if you can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all." That doesn't mean to keep your disapproval or opinions to yourself, it just means people need to contribute in a way that is not offensive. An internet forum has a different dynamic than say a conversation with a group of people, so it needs to be approached differently. A bunch of opinionated posts will result in opinionated responses, which result in more opinions... and while opinions are ok to voice, they aren't helpful because they are basically selfish terminated statements. Opinions are like... Sporeifaces, everyone's got one, and everyone knows it. So state your opinion if you must, but follow it up with why you feel that way. Give someone something to respond to and to discuss, instead of bating them into an opinionated statement of their own. And yes, maybe I'm not the best one to preach from the pulpit, but if we all make an effort to better conversation rather than force an opinion, I think (opinion alert!) the forum will be a much friendlier place.

I can't disagree with that (well I could but I'd be lying).

Personally I feel the reason much of the suggestions have gone out the door and been replaced with straight ranting is we are missing one part of this discussion.

The response.

EA has declared (according to one maxis rep that posted on these forums) that they are not allowed to speak with us. This leaves us to only assume the worst because the last time EA did this that I know of (Command and Conquer Renegade) the game went from 50 dollars to 9.99 and then vanished in the course of 60 days. It only recently re-popped up in packs with other west wood games.

It leaves people incredibly upset when their words fall upon deaf ears, you wait long enough and the construction that is going on is a bon fire to burn the infidels.

When are they gonna have a fix for this patch is my question, cuz I still can't save my game!

theultimateend wrote:

I can't disagree with that (well I could but I'd be lying).

LOL, at least you're honest!

theultimateend wrote:
Personally I feel the reason much of the suggestions have gone out the door and been replaced with straight ranting is we are missing one part of this discussion.

The response.

EA has declared (according to one maxis rep that posted on these forums) that they are not allowed to speak with us. This leaves us to only assume the worst because the last time EA did this that I know of (Command and Conquer Renegade) the game went from 50 dollars to 9.99 and then vanished in the course of 60 days. It only recently re-popped up in packs with other west wood games.

It leaves people incredibly upset when their words fall upon deaf ears, you wait long enough and the construction that is going on is a bon fire to burn the infidels.

AMEN there brother. Which brings us back to the thread title. If EA can't speak to us, then it would be nice if in the very least, they simply gave us a clue as to what they were up to. They don't need to respond directly, but a comment from them confirming they reviewed a certain thread and that they were going to address it, or had more important things to deal with first. SOMETHING. Even a "Yeah, we read the rant, will address later, but first need to fix complexity inconsistencies." It doesn't even have to be a two sided conversation. It could be a locked thread addressed to no one in particular.

StevenMC wrote:

theultimateend wrote:
Personally I feel the reason much of the suggestions have gone out the door and been replaced with straight ranting is we are missing one part of this discussion.

The response.

EA has declared (according to one maxis rep that posted on these forums) that they are not allowed to speak with us. This leaves us to only assume the worst because the last time EA did this that I know of (Command and Conquer Renegade) the game went from 50 dollars to 9.99 and then vanished in the course of 60 days. It only recently re-popped up in packs with other west wood games.

It leaves people incredibly upset when their words fall upon deaf ears, you wait long enough and the construction that is going on is a bon fire to burn the infidels.

AMEN there brother. Which brings us back to the thread title. If EA can't speak to us, then it would be nice if in the very least, they simply gave us a clue as to what they were up to. They don't need to respond directly, but a comment from them confirming they reviewed a certain thread and that they were going to address it, or had more important things to deal with first. SOMETHING. Even a "Yeah, we read the rant, will address later, but first need to fix complexity inconsistencies." It doesn't even have to be a two sided conversation. It could be a locked thread addressed to no one in particular.

Exactly. I think we're all getting on the same page. It's not like we're Congress asking the President of the US for a detailed timeline of how the troops will be brought home. We just want something! Be it a trickle of information that says good or bad, or even a waterfall of information (including detailed maps of the EA headquarters as well as pass codes and fake ID badges, the location of the original 2005 spore, maybe a plan written by Will himself for infiltration and recovery of said 2005 spore).

In any case, I wait. I no longer play, however, I will when the information is released as well as some bugs are fixed, and the DRM/SecuROM is removed.

Hindsight89 wrote:Exactly. I think we're all getting on the same page. It's not like we're Congress asking the President of the US for a detailed timeline of how the troops will be brought home. We just want something! Be it a trickle of information that says good or bad, or even a waterfall of information (including detailed maps of the EA headquarters as well as pass codes and fake ID badges, the location of the original 2005 spore, maybe a plan written by Will himself for infiltration and recovery of said 2005 spore).

I'm in.

Cysgodi wrote:My opinion is that Maxis will respond when they feel they have something solid and important to tell us.

Fine, that's your opinion. Obviously, I don't share it; that's also fine.

And because I don't share your opinion, I'm going to keep agitating for a response of some kind, rather than this resounding silence.
If that annoys you, I suggest you avoid me, because you won't badger me into shutting up. That's...really the extent to which our point/counter-point can go unless you have something else to say.

It would be hard for me to refute what you are going on about because they have not responded. That is true. But, I see their non response as them working hard to fix problems, where as you see it as they don’t care what you think or don’t want to hear your opinions.

First of all, don't try to tell me what I think; I'll tell YOU what I think. It's this trying to assign me a position rather than actually hearing my explicitly stated position that has brought us to the internet equivalent of blows.
Second, how friggin' hard is it to post a message on the Spore site? Ten minutes? Twenty minutes? Tops? I genuinely don't see how a non-response indicates "working hard" when giving a response would barely be a blip in someone work schedule. "Working hard" is no excuse for non-communication. Period.

We don’t know either way. So does that make both our opinions wrong?

No, it makes both our opinions uniformed, based in complete ignorance.

It's that ignorance which I am trying to CORRECT. By goading Maxis into a response of some kind. Personal, impersonal, posted here or on the Spore site, I don't give a flying fornication...just so long as they do it.

I will respectfully ask that you stop disparaging me with your “past your bedtime” comments and “playing well with the other kids” comments. You have done just as much with the thinly veiled personal attacks as you feel I have.

Only because you're being obnoxious and need to be taken down a peg or two for your own good and, frankly, for mine, and everybody else's. If you hadn't begun by making this personal--and you did, and you know it--this conversation could have gone in a VERY different direction. But rather than trying to refute what I said, you decided to discuss ME; that was your mistake, and from then on you've pretty much brought everything upon yourself.
If you have an issue you'd like to raise or discuss about what's being said, please do discuss it, but if all you want to talk about is who's saying it and HOW, no point you make will be taken as valid. None. Because you've made it personal. And I'm pretty sure a mod has already told you--directly and personally--just how against the rules that is; I advise you listen. Again, for all our sakes.