CopperLou wrote:

Vilageidiotx wrote:

CopperLou wrote:Eh, I don't really care. I suppose if someone got a feature with a stolen creation, then yeah, that would be pretty ridiculous. Although, I don't think Maxis would make that mistake.

I believe that has happened, I just don't recall what it was.

Seriously? Wow, I thought featured creations were supposed to be original.

You know that, I know that, everyone else know that, and Maxis knows that. They're just to lazy to check lineage (which they programmed).

I'm getting more okay with creation thieves. I've been placing my name in the tags and most thieves are too stupid to take it out. The ones who take it out and say "Made completely by me" deserve pain.

It's happened, but when people told them, they featured the original creator, as well.

What do people want -- an anit-feature like a retraction where they take away any posts the other guy got. Holy cow that's perverse.

I don't care if someone takes one of my creatures, changes NOTHING and gets MPN and featured with it. Honestly.

I care about my creatures, I make them with care and I like playing with them. I wouldn't make them differently if they were popular or not -- which means if other people like what I'm doing well enough to play with it too -- well I hope they are happy and learn something.

But whether they do or not, they are not my responsibility, and neither are my creatures, once they are on the server.

Some people would be amazed how freeing that is -- put them out there, and quit worrying over it.

Make another one, and another after that.

If I can make one, I can make a thousand. And when I run out of them, I'll quit playing, and I'll never think about it again. I'll be making something else.

im cool with it...as long as they give me credit

ashkelon wrote:It's happened, but when people told them, they featured the original creator, as well.

What do people want -- an anit-feature like a retraction where they take away any posts the other guy got. Holy cow that's perverse.

I don't care if someone takes one of my creatures, changes NOTHING and gets MPN and featured with it. Honestly.

I care about my creatures, I make them with care and I like playing with them. I wouldn't make them differently if they were popular or not -- which means if other people like what I'm doing well enough to play with it too -- well I hope they are happy and learn something.

But whether they do or not, they are not my responsibility, and neither are my creatures, once they are on the server.

Some people would be amazed how freeing that is -- put them out there, and quit worrying over it.

Make another one, and another after that.

If I can make one, I can make a thousand. And when I run out of them, I'll quit playing, and I'll never think about it again. I'll be making something else.

Your stoicism is admirable, but not everyone ultimately is like that. It isn't to much to ask that credit go where credit is due. I will go one further in that, should someone change YOUR creation and get it featured, it would bother ME. I don't believe in rewarding people for absolutely no effort, and doing so simply devalues the entire rewards system in spore.

I should mind, but I don't.

Vilageidiotx wrote:... It isn't too much to ask that credit go where credit is due. I will go one further in that, should someone change YOUR creation and get it featured, it would bother ME. I don't believe in rewarding people for absolutely no effort, and doing so simply devalues the entire rewards system in spore.

But, the intended purpose of the "Creature Tweeker" tool is that others can take your creations and improve on them. Most inventions are made that way, using things others have made and combining them in new ways.

Go ahead and use my published creations anyway you want. If you give me credit that would be a nice voluntary gesture, however it is not a mandatory requirement. And if you get a feature from something that I originally thought of and designed, well you used it better than I did. Good for you!

No matter how much some of you complain about it, the fact is that Maxis legally owns the rights to our published creations -- not us. Anyone who buys Spore is granted the use of everything that Maxis makes available in it -- including submitted creations by users.

Eochaid1701 wrote:My policy is that others can use my stuff, but they darn well better credit me, or I would be royally angry.

same

Treb2466 wrote:

Vilageidiotx wrote:... It isn't too much to ask that credit go where credit is due. I will go one further in that, should someone change YOUR creation and get it featured, it would bother ME. I don't believe in rewarding people for absolutely no effort, and doing so simply devalues the entire rewards system in spore.

But, the intended purpose of the "Creature Tweeker" tool is that others can take your creations and improve on them. Most inventions are made that way, using things others have made and combining them in new ways.

Go ahead and use my published creations anyway you want. If you give me credit that would be a nice voluntary gesture, however it is not a mandatory requirement. And if you get a feature from something that I originally thought of and designed, well you used it better than I did. Good for you!

No matter how much some of you complain about it, the fact is that Maxis legally owns the rights to our published creations -- not us. Anyone who buys Spore is granted the use of everything that Maxis makes available in it -- including submitted creations by users.

I don't consider it literal stealing, and I understand the rights to the creations aren't mine.

It is a matter of Honor, not legality.

Call me crazy, but I tend to like to congratulate the person responsible for the achievement, not the guy trying to impersonate him for attention. It just seems to me that in most situations, the "Give credit where credit is due" gig is considered ethically sound.

In regards to creature tweaking, If someone improves upon my design in such a way that my design was a minor element, I don't care, it ceases to me my creation in essence at that point.

Don't get me wrong, I don't go about constantly worried about this issue, nor is it a matter of attention or fear that somehow I will loose something out of the deal, I know that there isn't really any effect beyond it being frustrating. I also don't do anything about it, I don't post insulting comments or cause any issues beyond not commenting on the creations of someone who reuploads a lot of other peoples creations (and this is a practice I started before lineage, not for "Punishment", but rather because I couldn't tell what they were really responsible for).

Is it just me who sees this plagiarism deal as an ethically breach?

Vilageidiotx wrote:I don't consider it literal stealing, and I understand the rights to the creations aren't mine. It is a matter of Honor, not legality.

Call me crazy, but I tend to like to congratulate the person responsible for the achievement, not the guy trying to impersonate him for attention.... Is it just me who sees this plagiarism deal as an ethically breach?

You are making a wild assumption that everyone re-sharing a "tweeked" creation is doing that "for attention". You don't know their real motives or reasons. Most times they probably meant no harm.

If I use something in a Galactic Adventure, then I have no choice but must re-publish those things. With over 36,000 things in my Sporepedia now (quite a few are tweeked versions), there is no way I can remember where they all came from originally. Usually, I try to catch the creator's name, as it is displayed briefly during the game, and put it in the description. But, I miss some or forget the name by the time I am done making changes. It's not intentional.

Your charge that this re-sharing is plagiarism is inaccurate and harsh. Plagiarism is the act of taking credit for someone else's work. So, unless a person puts a claim of having originally designed a creation, they have not broken this rule. That is the clear ethical line that can not be crossed. Simply re-sharing does not violate that principle.

It seems that as time goes by in Spore, people are becoming more comfortable with the idea that "shared" mean giving up rights to your creations. This generosity has benefited everyone, even those who resisted it.

Treb2466 wrote:You are making a wild assumption that everyone re-sharing a "tweeked" creation is doing that "for attention". You don't know their real motives or reasons. Most times they probably meant no harm.

I understand this. Hell, early in my spore career I did this, as in I used another players vehicles (raptor1994, I owe him the attention, Excellent vehicle maker) in colonies and they were uploaded in my name. I went out and fully apologized to the guy though rather then bring up the lack of real rights to these things. Again, honor.

Treb2466 wrote:If I use something in a Galactic Adventure, then I have no choice but must re-publish those things. With over 36,000 things in my Sporepedia now (quite a few are tweeked versions), there is no way I can remember where they all came from originally. Usually, I try to catch the creator's name, as it is displayed briefly during the game, and put it in the description. But, I miss some or forget the name by the time I am done making changes. It's not intentional.

At least you try, thats great. That being said, I have used a lot of things from other players in GA and they don't get reposted under my name.

Treb2466 wrote:Your charge that this re-sharing is plagiarism is inaccurate and harsh. Plagiarism is the act of taking credit for someone else's work. So, unless a person puts a claim of having originally designed a creation, they have not broken this rule. That is the clear ethical line that can not be crossed. Simply re-sharing does not violate that principle.

So, Logically, I could copy paste another persons work and turn it into class, and as long as I never say "I totally made this", I am not plagiarizing. You can point out that I signed the paper, but when something is posted on your sporepedia, it is signed in the sense your name caps it. Re-sharing on accident is understandably a blurry zone, and I understand that, but it also isn't a habit we should support. Again, I have acted my words out in this area. None the same, plagiarism is the correct term.

Treb2466 wrote:It seems that as time goes by in Spore, people are becoming more comfortable with the idea that "shared" mean giving up rights to your creations. This generosity has benefited everyone, even those who resisted it.

Again, I am not saying there are literal rights. This generosity simply blurs the lines of who are the true creators and who are not, I am not seeing it as having benefited anybody really.

It's not stoicism.

Perhaps it's recognizing what the "award" is "worth".

There's a long-standing tradition among chess players and competition dog trainers (both of which I am).

In dog obedience the "A" classes are for newbies. If you win a trophy somewhere (and don't immediately give it back to the club who awarded it) you donate it for use in the "A" classes.

People who've nev er won trophies are delighted wih them. The fun pales when you have a box of them in the closet because there are no more open walls in the house.

Treb and I come from a common culture where we know we "stand on the shoulders of giants". Our whole industry is based on astonishingly brilliant work by people we don't know and can't credit.

It makes what I create no less brilliant because I use the work of others to solve the problems closer to home, but I also know others will take my freely given work and use it to build their own devices.

There is no sin in that. It's the way creation is.

I can't begin to cite how many times Li Po or Lao Tze or Albrecht Duerer influenced my work. Powerfully.

And even in Spore.

Oh crap I have been doing that for all of my adventure! And because there are so much creatures (all of them) that are not mine, I never put on a credit page showing who did what. The only thing I said in one of my adventure was "Stuff made by a lot of people".

If I accidentally used you work I'm very sorry. I will remove them if you want to.

But I really do think they are awsome and deserves praise.